Introduction\n
\nMy name is Stéphanie Hamon or ‘Amon’ if you pronounce it the French way. And I've now for over two years been the head of legal operations consulting at Norton Rose Fulbright. I'm not a lawyer by background, but I've been working in the industry for over 20 years. And now what I'm trying to do is very much helping the in-house team be the best it can be basically, but run themselves as a business and be efficient.
Part 1: Don’t sweat the small stuff\n
\nI think there's often been a misconception that legal innovation always has to be something that is big, runs for years, involves lots of people, costs a fortune, but actually sometimes just small incremental improvements can really have a big impact. I much rather go for initiative who actually don’t really require a lot of investment, but really have an impact. And when I go back on the time when I was working at Barclays, a lot of initiative initially, we did not have a lot of budget for, and it was all done on paper and pen almost, you know, the best tool we had at the time, are Word and Excel spreadsheets, and yet we were able to drive some change and that I find quite exciting.
Part 2: Defining Legal Operations\n
\nIf I try to link back what I did at Barclays at the time and legal ops generally, because my title at the time wasn't even legal operations. And, and to be fair, I think if you asked 10 people were LegalOps is about you'd get 10 different answers. What I found very interesting at the time was basically a series of problems and statements the GC wanted help with, one of which was changing the narrative around the group from a cost center to a strategy enabler. But the second one was around reviewing how the team was interacting with its law firms through the panel. That's been something that I have experienced from the other side, cause they used to be private practice. And it was really interesting for me to try and look at how I would do it as a client. And yes, I think we introduced a different way of doing things and that didn't go without issues and challenges. And we even had some firms say to me that coming to an appointment to me to cause me was like going to the dentist appointment, that kind of stuff, you know, you have to do, but you really don't want to, because we were trying to get them to change the way they were delivering their legal service to us.
And that was uncomfortable, but I'm sure we must have done something, right? Because at the end we ended up winning the legal operations team award of the year in 2019. And that same firm actually, when I left, invited us to dinner and said that, yes, fair enough, at the beginning, they didn't really like me, but after working with me for nearly four years, they could see that we were trying very much to drive change that was positive for all parties involved.
\nAnd that as a result, not only did our relationship with them improve, but the way they were interacting with their clients improved as well. And they were applying tools and techniques and methodology we gave them with other clients which made them really successful.
\nPart 3: The relationship model\n
\nSo the law firm relationship model, okay, so taking a big step back, there are two ways that clients can engage with a law firm. You can do that on a relationship based model on a transactional base model and there's no right or wrong model. It really depends on your organization and its speeds. However, if you do need to regularly reach out to external firm either because you don't have the resource yourself or you don't have the skill set, you want to make sure that this law firm do truly become an extension of your in-house function. So that's another of the buzzword we hear a lot. So the relationship model that we develop at Barclays and is very much meant to help explain what being a true extension of the in-house function mean. That's all based on the fact that it's almost irrelevant.
Who does deliver the piece of legal advice, whether it's your in-house lawyer, whether it's a piece of tech or it's your external firm, everybody needs to be very much aligned to your strategic objective and understand what it is you're trying to achieve. So the relationship model is very important in order to give enough information to the firm. So they understand what you're expecting from them.\nAnd while I saw that broken in the past is the relationship between firms and clients were driven through panel arrangements, drafted a little by procurement, and it's not a criticism of procurement, but usually there's been a lack of understanding of the idiosyncrasies of the legal department.
\nSo they reverted back to the only thing they could assess from on, which was their rates. But they're much more to the relationship than just the price you pay you, that you get different quality advice, but you also get different way of delivering that advice. And if I'm an in-house lawyer, ultimately, I wanted advice on my business and I don't want to have to be the middleman between my law firm and the business. So all of that for instance, is part and parcel to how you work with your law firm.
\nPart 4: You can handle the truth\n
\nLike in any relationship, an element of feedback and that's probably the hardest part because nobody likes to give constructive feedback as the British say. It's always easy to say when things go right, but when things go wrong, it's much harder to give and that's been missing a lot. So any good relationship model has to include the feedback loop and I should add that should also come from the firm to the in-house team. It's somewhat harder to achieve because you're still in a client supplier dynamic. So it's hard to tell your client that what they've put into are wrong, but the feedback should very much be part of that relationship.
Part 5: The business of law\n
\nSo for a long time legal department didn't really have to operate the same way as other business teamwork like HR or finance because they were making problem go away. And nobody really understood what they were doing, like, so jargony. But I think there's been a shift since the financial crisis where all companies became really cost conscious. And as a result, they really needed to understand how that money was spent by the legal department. So there was really a need to understand how that money was spent. And there was a perception, because of that lack of business management skill set in the legal function. So usually legal function, are only staffed with lawyers and that's part of the training lawyers don't get any business skills. As a result, it was almost taken away from legal to run some of the pricing elements and procurement got involved. And what you ended up seeing in a lot of cases was a race to the bottom. Who can give me the cheapest. The problem is there's this saying, I think in England, which is, if you pay peanuts, you get monkeys. Well that's exactly right. And the same applies to law firm. You can get the same advice for cheaper, but you might not get the results you want, or you might have a thing doubled after.
So price is an indicator of quality but it’s not the only one. And that's really important that you therefore look at things that we call them, I think we penned that term at Barclays, called EFAs (Effective Fee Arrangement). It's not so much about the throughput, it's about the output and the deliverables and the quality and the strategic value of the work you are getting.
\nPart 6: Unlocking the power of data with Legal Operations\n
\nSo I never thought, well, I never started my career thinking I'd end up being a legal ops professional. That didn't even exist when I started working 20 years ago. But I can see how, um, this is becoming a unique role both in law firm and on the in-house side to really help take the industry and the function to a different level.
It's just about modernising the way things are being done and suddenly adding access to a wealth of information. So I think that's the one thing I get the most excited about. Yes, I like things tidy and organised and that helps with legal ops because it's a lot about process and process is about making sure that whatever you do, there's a beginning, there's a middle, there's an end and things are being done in the right order. So that I like, but the bit that really I think is going to be transformative for LegalOps, that access to the data because suddenly you can really make informed decision. You can dispel myth and you can really have drive the direction of your strategy.
\nPart 7: The more or less dichotomy\n
\nThere's no doubt that the current business model of law firms is, is an impediment to driving change and innovation. And they haven't been traditionally incentivized to deliver things efficiently because the model was, the more time you spend doing a piece of work at the more hours you have to charge and the more money you're going to make. So of course, by definition, you're not incentivized to do things quick. The problem is now, and that's what I was saying earlier, now the in-house team are far more comfortable about how they're spending the money and a lot of them, although I had the sentence, but have to do more for less, they need to show that they can deliver efficiency. ‘Cause the problem, when you're a legal department, or an in-house department, and that's what really looked for me to understand, so, you don't control the demand that is coming through to your team. You're dependent on how busy the business is. So you can't control that demand you have to deliver, but yet you're being asked to cut your budget. So that's, that's a bit of a conundrum.
The only lever that the in-house team have is around delivering efficiency. So doing the same for less money, and that's where the pressure comes from. And that's why when client asks law firm to give them price certainty and value bidding, that's what they mean. But often they haven't quite explained that in the narrative, there is however a bit of a change and a shift within the law firm that understands that now. So we’re moving away from the traditional highly rate model and that's where the delivery element comes into play. So we're starting to see a bit of a shift, but I don't think until more clients put more pressure, that's really going to change quickly.
\nPart 8: People first\n
\nSo it's true that often people misconstrue legal innovation for LegalTech. And they think all innovation has to be about tech, which is not, which is not true. Tech is a great enabler, but there's a reason why we say people process technology in that order and technology last. And actually it's more people, process, data, technology these days, which is a great debridement as well. But if you don't have the right people wanting to drive and adopt the change, if you don't, if you haven't picked the process, as in who does what, when, in what order you run the risk of choosing the wrong tech.\nSo that's why tech comes last in, in that order.
And innovation is not about, and, and I think I've said that earlier, so I might repeat myself here, but innovation isn't about big bang project. Innovation is about improving the way you're currently doing things, not just for the sake of change, but for the sake of improvements.
\nPart 9: Unlocking the power of data with LawAdvisor\n
\nWell, I think I'm most excited about when it comes to LawAdvisor that there probably actually are two things. The first one is the, all in one place, in a way making it easy and going from one element of the value chain to the next.
I was talking earlier about the process with, there’s a beginning, a middle and an end and being clear as to when people should be doing what and in what order? So that really helps with that flow and clarifying for people and making it seamless. Also then I became a bit of a nerd, I guess in my LegalOps role. I became really big on data and making sure I do have the information to be able to make an informed decision.
\nAnd we talked earlier about change management. The best way to get people to adopt change is to show them facts and information so that you can correct their perception, but also show them where the potentials are. And it's really hard to do that if you're working off perceptions, I think the data is critical and I think that's at the heart of the advisors. So that's what gets me excited.
","frontmatter":{"date":"May 04, 2019","slug":"/learn/legal-ops-a-framework-for-success","title":"LegalOps","subtitle":"As the Head of Legal Operations Consulting at Norton Rose Fulbright, and armed with over 20 years of experience in delivering commercial management strategies for in-house legal departments, Stéphanie discusses the rising trend of legal operations and the strong appetite for innovation. She juxtaposes this with a close examination of the barriers preventing widespread adoption of modern day innovations and reminds us all that the business of law is a people business.","subheading":"a framework for success","episode":8,"source":"https://player.vimeo.com/video/718299526?h=ed3e1577a7&badge=0&autopause=0&player_id=0&app_id=58479","thumbnail":"/images/learn/stephanie.png"}},"allMarkdownRemark":{"nodes":[{"frontmatter":{"duration":"11 MINUTES","episode":1,"title":"Lawyers and Technologists","subheading":"the twain shall meet","subtitle":"World renowned technologist Lars Rasmussen shares his views on why the law needs to change and how law firms can obtain a competitive advantage by adopting tools that their practice and their clients so desperately need.","slug":"/learn/lawyers-and-technologists","thumbnail":"/images/learn/lars.png"}},{"frontmatter":{"duration":"15 MINUTES","episode":10,"title":"LegalOps","subheading":"from Theory to Lift-Off","subtitle":"In this exclusive masterclass, LegalOps titan Mary O'Carroll guides us through the transformative changes happening within the legal ecosystem. With a remarkable background that includes leadership roles at Google and the founding of the Corporate Legal Operations Consortium (CLOC), her insights span the evolution of legal operations and the pivotal role of technology in shaping the future of legal services. Join us for a masterclass that will inspire and inform as we explore the changing landscape of the legal profession with a true industry visionary.","slug":"/learn/legalops-from-theory-to-lift-off","thumbnail":"/images/learn/mary.png"}},{"frontmatter":{"duration":"8 MINUTES","episode":2,"title":"Judgment Day","subheading":"the rise of the tech-enabled law firm","subtitle":"Having served as CEO of Bird & Bird since 1996, and having grown the firm to well over 1,300 lawyers across 29 offices, David shares his views about why he believes the best law firm in the world is one that is most tech-enabled.","slug":"/learn/judgment-day","thumbnail":"/images/learn/david.png"}},{"frontmatter":{"duration":"6 MINUTES","episode":3,"title":"Legal Innovation","subheading":"We can do more","subtitle":"As a world renowned thought leader in the area of legal operations, technology and the business of law, Jason shares his views on why the industry, and you, can do so much more in the area of legal innovation.","slug":"/learn/legal-innovation","thumbnail":"/images/learn/jason.png"}},{"frontmatter":{"duration":"20 MINUTES","episode":4,"title":"LegalOps","subheading":"what's the fuss?","subtitle":"Experienced leaders in the legal operations and legal technology space, and who both led the Barclays team that was named Legal Operations team of the year at the 2019 UK Legal 500 Awards, Chris and Stéphanie - in their own unique way - share their views about the industry's hottest topics: from legal technology, legal operations, and how you can use legal ops and data-driven decision making to improve legal service delivery.","slug":"/learn/legal-ops-whats-the-fuss","thumbnail":"/images/learn/stephanie-chris.png"}},{"frontmatter":{"duration":"9 MINUTES","episode":5,"title":"Panel Firms","subheading":"It's all about the relationships!","subtitle":"As a relationship manager at Barclays, Paul discusses - through first hand experience - why panel firms are important and the value that in-house departments like Barclays are seeking from the law firms within their panel. Paul discusses Barclays' initiatives when it comes to strengthening their relationship with their law firms, and shares his views on why technology is helping relationships thrive in this new normal.","slug":"/learn/panel-firms","thumbnail":"/images/learn/paul.png"}},{"frontmatter":{"duration":"5 MINUTES","episode":6,"title":"Paving the way for #legaltech adoption","subheading":"","subtitle":"As the Lead Practice Innovation & Knowledge Counsel for Paul Hastings, and armed with 18 years of experience in the industry, Catherine continues to push the boundaries for change, education, and legal technology. Having co-founded Paul Hastings’ Legal Tech University, and named as one of the 2020 'European Women of Legal Tech', listen to Catherine share her thoughts on how legal technology can transform the delivery of legal services, and why the future of the legal industry is bright.","slug":"/learn/paving-the-way-for-legaltech-adoption","thumbnail":"/images/learn/catherine.png"}},{"frontmatter":{"duration":"8 MINUTES","episode":7,"title":"Legal Project Management","subheading":"it's here to stay","subtitle":"As the Head of Legal Project Management at Ashurst, and formerly Barclays' Legal Project Portfolio Manager, Helga shares her wisdom from years' of experience about how legal project management principles paired with the right technology can supercharge the efficient delivery of legal services.","slug":"/learn/legal-project-management","thumbnail":"/images/learn/helga.png"}},{"frontmatter":{"duration":"12 MINUTES","episode":8,"title":"LegalOps","subheading":"a framework for success","subtitle":"As the Head of Legal Operations Consulting at Norton Rose Fulbright, and armed with over 20 years of experience in delivering commercial management strategies for in-house legal departments, Stéphanie discusses the rising trend of legal operations and the strong appetite for innovation. She juxtaposes this with a close examination of the barriers preventing widespread adoption of modern day innovations and reminds us all that the business of law is a people business.","slug":"/learn/legal-ops-a-framework-for-success","thumbnail":"/images/learn/stephanie.png"}},{"frontmatter":{"duration":"10 MINUTES","episode":9,"title":"Digital Transformation","subheading":"and the Modernisation of Legal Operations","subtitle":"Chris Grant, one of the world’s preeminent lawtech and LegalOps voices, speaks to LawAdvisor about the modernisation of legal operations and the opportunities it has created for legal technology companies.","slug":"/learn/digital-transformation","thumbnail":"/images/learn/chris.png"}}]}},"pageContext":{"slug":"/learn/legal-ops-a-framework-for-success"}}}